This seems to be a remnant of the old days, carrying on the business traditions of 1980's holographer pseudo-businessmen. All the other old timers are out of business, often for similar reasons of their own invention. Some good ones were crushed by others.
I am very sorry for your miserable experience. The history of our field is not pretty. There are many reasons why holography is not a commercial success. Bad business practices long ago by dreamy holographers who went all gaga when a checkbook walked in the room alienated most investors. Lots of money lost. It saddens me to hear that such idiocy still goes on, a good holography transaction is a rare and beautiful thing.
But, in another light, did your competition get anywhere with their knock-off? or did they just lose money too? Learn from those failures.
** This was a reply to a post that was out of policy and was deleted. I left the reply because I though it had relevance to the past of holography. ~ Colin**
Thoughts on Holography Failures...
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John Sonley
Thoughts on Holography Failures...
Jeffery, about 20 years ago I was on a business trip to Stockholm and walked past a shop selling holograms.
What I saw fascinated me and I wanted to learn that more. At that time I was working for a company that had good years and bad years and I felt I needed a change.
Living in a fairly large house with a basement I built my first holography laboratory.
I bought a 10 mW Spectra Physics laser and built/bought the rest of the equipment necessary to make holograms based on a sandbox.
As a scientist and engineer I learned a how to make a hologram, initially very badly but slowly they improved - the learning curve to holography was the longest of any venture I have attempted
After about a year my job was not going well and I decided to create a business making holograms.
With a Wife, two teenage children and a mortgage I started to do my sums and realised at a fairly early stage that with the technology I had at my disposal, to produce small 5” X 4” green and yellow holograms and thereafter sell them, was not going to generate sufficient money to pay my outgoings.
Fortunately, common sense eventually prevailed and I re-directed my attentions to creating a consultancy in the oil and gas industry. This proved to be a good decision and the consultancy prospered for 20 years until my retirement four years ago, when I sold it to my business partner
Now, in retirement I have the time to indulge myself in my hobby, making holograms.
In the summer I am busy in the garden but during the winter I come inside to my holography laboratory and enjoy myself
If you have a look at my web site to view my laboratory and the holograms I make:
www.johnsonley.myzen.co.uk
You will see some of the holograms I make and it is no longer a business, all I try to do is to recover the costs of the chemicals and film
Brgds
John
What I saw fascinated me and I wanted to learn that more. At that time I was working for a company that had good years and bad years and I felt I needed a change.
Living in a fairly large house with a basement I built my first holography laboratory.
I bought a 10 mW Spectra Physics laser and built/bought the rest of the equipment necessary to make holograms based on a sandbox.
As a scientist and engineer I learned a how to make a hologram, initially very badly but slowly they improved - the learning curve to holography was the longest of any venture I have attempted
After about a year my job was not going well and I decided to create a business making holograms.
With a Wife, two teenage children and a mortgage I started to do my sums and realised at a fairly early stage that with the technology I had at my disposal, to produce small 5” X 4” green and yellow holograms and thereafter sell them, was not going to generate sufficient money to pay my outgoings.
Fortunately, common sense eventually prevailed and I re-directed my attentions to creating a consultancy in the oil and gas industry. This proved to be a good decision and the consultancy prospered for 20 years until my retirement four years ago, when I sold it to my business partner
Now, in retirement I have the time to indulge myself in my hobby, making holograms.
In the summer I am busy in the garden but during the winter I come inside to my holography laboratory and enjoy myself
If you have a look at my web site to view my laboratory and the holograms I make:
www.johnsonley.myzen.co.uk
You will see some of the holograms I make and it is no longer a business, all I try to do is to recover the costs of the chemicals and film
Brgds
John
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salvee
Thoughts on Holography Failures...
I think one of the failures of holograms is the lack of integral lighting. One cannot expect ordinary consumers to set up a special lighting unit just for the hologram. I know that some holograms are sold with an appropriate spot lamp- but this needs to be wired in, and unless done professionally, can leave unsightly wires snaking their way round the walls.
Lack of colour is another stumbling block, although this seems to be slowly changing, if reports about new photopolymers about to hit the market are to be believed.
Finally- artistic content. Why have a hologram of a statue when you can have a statue itself? Holographic images need to present 3d images in a form that cannot be replicated in real life. An example of this are digital holograms created by Jacques Desbiens.
Lack of colour is another stumbling block, although this seems to be slowly changing, if reports about new photopolymers about to hit the market are to be believed.
Finally- artistic content. Why have a hologram of a statue when you can have a statue itself? Holographic images need to present 3d images in a form that cannot be replicated in real life. An example of this are digital holograms created by Jacques Desbiens.
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Kaveh
Thoughts on Holography Failures...
Fully agree. We can't sell a great hologram for 100s or 1000s, then ask the client to screw a light bulb in the ceiling or hang an ugly metal bar at the top of the hologram.salvee wrote:I think one of the failures of holograms is the lack of integral lighting. One cannot expect ordinary consumers to set up a special lighting unit just for the hologram. I know that some holograms are sold with an appropriate spot lamp- but this needs to be wired in, and unless done professionally, can leave unsightly wires snaking their way round the walls.
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John Sonley
Thoughts on Holography Failures...
I agree regarding the difficulty of displaying and illuminating a framed hologram in a manner suited to a smart living room - but if I can mention a simple and low cost light source I came across accidently when searching for something like an 'Anglepoise' light for my Wife when she's sewing.
I visited the IKEA store near Leeds and bought a small white LED based table light with a gooseneck type adjustable flexitube and the bulb in a small focussed housing at the end. The 3volt LED is powered by a small power unit housed in the 13A UK type plug .............. and for just viewing a hologram it does well. It cost about £12 - I think .
The Unit is marked JANSJO, IKEA Part No. 001.696.40
BRgds
John
I visited the IKEA store near Leeds and bought a small white LED based table light with a gooseneck type adjustable flexitube and the bulb in a small focussed housing at the end. The 3volt LED is powered by a small power unit housed in the 13A UK type plug .............. and for just viewing a hologram it does well. It cost about £12 - I think .
The Unit is marked JANSJO, IKEA Part No. 001.696.40
BRgds
John
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MfA
Thoughts on Holography Failures...
I wonder what those wedges cost which Adrian Travis used for his projection displays. It would seem the ideal backlight for a hologram (for a hologram the bulky reflector would not be necessary, just a light source and some optics, light comes out off axis for the display they use a diffusing layer).Kaveh wrote:Fully agree. We can't sell a great hologram for 100s or 1000s, then ask the client to screw a light bulb in the ceiling or hang an ugly metal bar at the top of the hologram.
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holo_cyware
Thoughts on Holography Failures...
I started with the holography about 2 years ago. The market in my area is totally virgin; no holography exhibitions, no museums, nothing. Many people can't tell what a hologram is, although they may already carry one (nokia logo on the cell phone's battery, visa card eagle, etc.). Having this and the fascination for holograms I decided to start something in this field. To be frank I also realized quite soon it may never ever come to the point where i'd make enough money out of this to pay off for my equipment, let alone to keep a family.
It all really boils down to this: the equipment is fairly expensive, expensive enough not to be seen as a normal "hobby" in the eyes of the wife. It certainly gives satisfactions for sure, but it also eats lots of time and money. And the return may never come.
When showing the holograms I've got (some *crappy* of mine, and some good ones (thanks John Sonley!)) to my friends/relatives they were all amazed, but then, the killer question ALWAYS came as a guillotine: "these are interesting, but what are these good for?"
People are interested in pragmatic things, and holograms apart from the amazement they produce are not their "wanted item" list for most. They are nice, interesting, freaky to some but that's it. They are the kind of thing you buy in the store outside the museum, only to build years of dust back home, till you eventually dig it up and slam it on ebay/sell it on the flea market. To most, the holograms belong to a museum, or to a sci fi movie. Let's not forget we may under 1000 guys keenly interested in them in the WHOLE friggin world. And we exchange/sell holograms among us. An exclusive club, that’s what we are.
As I see the things now, the only way of making money out of holography at an amateur level would be by producing holographic portraits ("Remember, you're dealing with the most powerful selling feature of all time: Vanity" - F. DeFreitas)
Holo art would be the other way.
As pointed before, in order to speak about a piece of holographic art, the hologram MUST represent something more then a box full of screws or coins, such a hologram should represent more then a gypsum little statue although the creator may have put his soul in the statue. An art hologram should be BIG. I mean, since it's a visual art 5”x4” ain’t gonna work here. Think about a painting: that would be the size of a hologram. Oh, did I ever mention to you what huge paintings I've seen some at Louvre? Now THAT would be art. Imagine an abstract, rainbow hologram, 3x4 meters. Maybe in 100 years, but I’d like to see it. Gotta haunt Louvre for the centuries to come, maybe they will appear.
Suppose you find your buyer: many here understand that you can't simply roll up the 1 meter film, and the buyer leaves with the roll in the hand and some thousands dollars less in the pocket. The buyer needs an all-in-one solution; you'd better go/hire someone else to go to the guys home and install the needed light display.
I enjoyed a lot reading how many years before DCG started to be commercial, and some would make medallions and such. Now the ebay is full of these, chinese made. Better give the master to the buyer to become truly unique; that's what the graphic art is about.
There’s the durability of the holos I’d speak about, but I’m too tired. Basically if someone pays a whole lot of money, he doesn’t want to hear that the great sealed DCG he bought may “vanish” in humid conditions.
That's all I can think off now. My lasers are building dust as I have a family to keep, I'm just dreaming the moment where I'd have enough time to do some holography sessions, and maybe even to innovate something in the field. Making money is far from this, it's the light at the end of the tunnel. In the mean time, it just keeps my mind sane, it's something to tickle my brain with, and makes the everyday struggle easier.
Pick up a hologram, just any hologram, admire it and feel the warmth in the heart. That’s all about it.
It all really boils down to this: the equipment is fairly expensive, expensive enough not to be seen as a normal "hobby" in the eyes of the wife. It certainly gives satisfactions for sure, but it also eats lots of time and money. And the return may never come.
When showing the holograms I've got (some *crappy* of mine, and some good ones (thanks John Sonley!)) to my friends/relatives they were all amazed, but then, the killer question ALWAYS came as a guillotine: "these are interesting, but what are these good for?"
People are interested in pragmatic things, and holograms apart from the amazement they produce are not their "wanted item" list for most. They are nice, interesting, freaky to some but that's it. They are the kind of thing you buy in the store outside the museum, only to build years of dust back home, till you eventually dig it up and slam it on ebay/sell it on the flea market. To most, the holograms belong to a museum, or to a sci fi movie. Let's not forget we may under 1000 guys keenly interested in them in the WHOLE friggin world. And we exchange/sell holograms among us. An exclusive club, that’s what we are.
As I see the things now, the only way of making money out of holography at an amateur level would be by producing holographic portraits ("Remember, you're dealing with the most powerful selling feature of all time: Vanity" - F. DeFreitas)
Holo art would be the other way.
As pointed before, in order to speak about a piece of holographic art, the hologram MUST represent something more then a box full of screws or coins, such a hologram should represent more then a gypsum little statue although the creator may have put his soul in the statue. An art hologram should be BIG. I mean, since it's a visual art 5”x4” ain’t gonna work here. Think about a painting: that would be the size of a hologram. Oh, did I ever mention to you what huge paintings I've seen some at Louvre? Now THAT would be art. Imagine an abstract, rainbow hologram, 3x4 meters. Maybe in 100 years, but I’d like to see it. Gotta haunt Louvre for the centuries to come, maybe they will appear.
Suppose you find your buyer: many here understand that you can't simply roll up the 1 meter film, and the buyer leaves with the roll in the hand and some thousands dollars less in the pocket. The buyer needs an all-in-one solution; you'd better go/hire someone else to go to the guys home and install the needed light display.
I enjoyed a lot reading how many years before DCG started to be commercial, and some would make medallions and such. Now the ebay is full of these, chinese made. Better give the master to the buyer to become truly unique; that's what the graphic art is about.
There’s the durability of the holos I’d speak about, but I’m too tired. Basically if someone pays a whole lot of money, he doesn’t want to hear that the great sealed DCG he bought may “vanish” in humid conditions.
That's all I can think off now. My lasers are building dust as I have a family to keep, I'm just dreaming the moment where I'd have enough time to do some holography sessions, and maybe even to innovate something in the field. Making money is far from this, it's the light at the end of the tunnel. In the mean time, it just keeps my mind sane, it's something to tickle my brain with, and makes the everyday struggle easier.
Pick up a hologram, just any hologram, admire it and feel the warmth in the heart. That’s all about it.
-
John Sonley
Thoughts on Holography Failures...
Ciorpan - good to see your posting and I think with the passage of time we will come to have similar thoughts.
I, like yourself have had the idea of making a business from holography - and I suspect at the 'top-end' of the market, security and large full colour photopolymer holograms, there will be money to be made but I'm 'a very small fish in a large pond' and with my 5" X 4" green-yellow image plane holograms I think it unlikely that I'll do any more than recover the costs of the hobby.
As I have now retired, this is what I want to do:
In the Summer when the weather is good I spend hours in my garden and that fully exercises both my body and mind, however .....
In the Winter, when it's cold and wet I come inside to my holography laboratory and spend hours with my hobby of trying to make simple but good holograms. The learning curve is steep and every day brings a new challenge which I find hugely stimulating for my mind - to exercise my body in the winter, it's the health club nearby
To recover costs I sell my holograms on EBay or directly from my web site - I've recently changed my Internet Service Provider and so my Web Site is now:
www.johnsonley.myzen.co.uk - have a peep and you'll see the type of hologram I'm making
Good to hear from you again and pleased that you liked my 'rejects'
BRgds
John
I, like yourself have had the idea of making a business from holography - and I suspect at the 'top-end' of the market, security and large full colour photopolymer holograms, there will be money to be made but I'm 'a very small fish in a large pond' and with my 5" X 4" green-yellow image plane holograms I think it unlikely that I'll do any more than recover the costs of the hobby.
As I have now retired, this is what I want to do:
In the Summer when the weather is good I spend hours in my garden and that fully exercises both my body and mind, however .....
In the Winter, when it's cold and wet I come inside to my holography laboratory and spend hours with my hobby of trying to make simple but good holograms. The learning curve is steep and every day brings a new challenge which I find hugely stimulating for my mind - to exercise my body in the winter, it's the health club nearby
To recover costs I sell my holograms on EBay or directly from my web site - I've recently changed my Internet Service Provider and so my Web Site is now:
www.johnsonley.myzen.co.uk - have a peep and you'll see the type of hologram I'm making
Good to hear from you again and pleased that you liked my 'rejects'
BRgds
John
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Jeffrey
Thoughts on Holography Failures...
Regarding portraits and vanity.
I've printed many portraits... usually the sitter, or their spouse, was disappointed. Too REAL. Too UNREAL. Portraits are supposed to flatter, not tell the truth, and holography lacks an airbrush or the ability to only shoot "their good side". Wrinkles, warts, whiskers, boogers, that "dead look" no matter what laser is used, that "I'm about to die in a mad-scientist's lab" look, due to the mad-scientist environment ... Even the fine portrait of Ronald Reagan (who was a fine sitter), by Hans Bjelkhagen, upon viewing in the lobby of the Reagan library, Nancy Reagan ordered it removed immediately, never to be seen again.
Vanity requires flattery, or lying; straight holography doesn't do either. And a green tint to the skin really doesn't flatter.
We have a ways to go...
I've printed many portraits... usually the sitter, or their spouse, was disappointed. Too REAL. Too UNREAL. Portraits are supposed to flatter, not tell the truth, and holography lacks an airbrush or the ability to only shoot "their good side". Wrinkles, warts, whiskers, boogers, that "dead look" no matter what laser is used, that "I'm about to die in a mad-scientist's lab" look, due to the mad-scientist environment ... Even the fine portrait of Ronald Reagan (who was a fine sitter), by Hans Bjelkhagen, upon viewing in the lobby of the Reagan library, Nancy Reagan ordered it removed immediately, never to be seen again.
Vanity requires flattery, or lying; straight holography doesn't do either. And a green tint to the skin really doesn't flatter.
We have a ways to go...
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holo_cyware
Thoughts on Holography Failures...
I fully agree with pulsed portraits; never saw one myself but I can imagine it's got to look really sharp, sharper than in the real life (due to the shadows).
I was thinking about multiplex holograms, where one can digitally alter the slideshow. Heck, no matter what pic in no matter what journal is photoshoped today. We give them what they are after.
I was thinking about multiplex holograms, where one can digitally alter the slideshow. Heck, no matter what pic in no matter what journal is photoshoped today. We give them what they are after.